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	<title>Comments on: Why I Dislike Classic Or Typical WCF Usage</title>
	<atom:link href="http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/</link>
	<description>Trying to walk that thin line between intelligence and ignorance</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 17 Mar 2010 18:22:17 +0100</lastBuildDate>
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		<item>
		<title>By: Hey Microsoft, Our Databases Aren&#8217;t Services! &#124; The Inquisitive Coder &#8211; Davy Brion&#39;s Blog</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-25203</link>
		<dc:creator>Hey Microsoft, Our Databases Aren&#8217;t Services! &#124; The Inquisitive Coder &#8211; Davy Brion&#39;s Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Jan 2010 17:46:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-25203</guid>
		<description>[...] consider that a benefit, though i can certainly understand why people would not want to deal with the pain of classic WCF services.&#160; RIA Services is simply a solution to the wrong [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] consider that a benefit, though i can certainly understand why people would not want to deal with the pain of classic WCF services.&#160; RIA Services is simply a solution to the wrong [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: kilfour</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-23199</link>
		<dc:creator>kilfour</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 07:11:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-23199</guid>
		<description>@SonOfPirate
&lt;i&gt;Seems like a pretty good endorsement.&lt;/i&gt;
&#039;Seems&#039; being the keyword in above statement. 
I&#039;m currently working on an application and I have a generated proxy in my project of almost 70.000 lines. 
Why ? Because I have to send a request to that CRM service to update a status field every once in a blue moon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@SonOfPirate<br />
<i>Seems like a pretty good endorsement.</i><br />
&#8216;Seems&#8217; being the keyword in above statement.<br />
I&#8217;m currently working on an application and I have a generated proxy in my project of almost 70.000 lines.<br />
Why ? Because I have to send a request to that CRM service to update a status field every once in a blue moon.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: SonOfPirate</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-23198</link>
		<dc:creator>SonOfPirate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 03:04:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-23198</guid>
		<description>For what it&#039;s worth, this is the model that Microsoft Dynamics uses for their web services in CRM (see CrmService).  Seems like a pretty good endorsement.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For what it&#8217;s worth, this is the model that Microsoft Dynamics uses for their web services in CRM (see CrmService).  Seems like a pretty good endorsement.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Arjan&#8217;s World &#187; LINKBLOG for Nov 18, 2009</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22986</link>
		<dc:creator>Arjan&#8217;s World &#187; LINKBLOG for Nov 18, 2009</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Nov 2009 16:05:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22986</guid>
		<description>[...] Service Layer (RRSL), i’d like to repeat the benefits of the RRSL that i stated in a previous post: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Service Layer (RRSL), i’d like to repeat the benefits of the RRSL that i stated in a previous post: [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Request/Response Service Layer Series &#124; The Inquisitive Coder &#8211; Davy Brion&#8217;s Blog</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22890</link>
		<dc:creator>Request/Response Service Layer Series &#124; The Inquisitive Coder &#8211; Davy Brion&#8217;s Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 12:16:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22890</guid>
		<description>[...] wrote a post a couple of months ago to discuss what i dislike about typical/classic WCF services and how the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] wrote a post a couple of months ago to discuss what i dislike about typical/classic WCF services and how the [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Benny Michielsen</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22209</link>
		<dc:creator>Benny Michielsen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 05:45:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22209</guid>
		<description>And with classes I mean clients.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And with classes I mean clients.</p>
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		<title>By: Benny Michielsen</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22208</link>
		<dc:creator>Benny Michielsen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 05:45:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22208</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m actually using this approach in one of my projects and like it a lot. For interoperability with other classes I&#039;d expose a service for that part of the system (i.e billing, customers,...) which internally will use the request handlers stuff as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m actually using this approach in one of my projects and like it a lot. For interoperability with other classes I&#8217;d expose a service for that part of the system (i.e billing, customers,&#8230;) which internally will use the request handlers stuff as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Charles Chen</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22207</link>
		<dc:creator>Charles Chen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:23:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22207</guid>
		<description>This is an interesting solution.

I&#039;m torn as it does solve a very real problem, but at the same time, it hinders discovery of operations.  To some extent, this is offset by the request classes, but there is a danger here of not knowing exactly how much data you need unless you create a request per call (whereas a method signature is much more explicit in terms of the parameterization).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is an interesting solution.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m torn as it does solve a very real problem, but at the same time, it hinders discovery of operations.  To some extent, this is offset by the request classes, but there is a danger here of not knowing exactly how much data you need unless you create a request per call (whereas a method signature is much more explicit in terms of the parameterization).</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Banwart&#8217;s Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Distributed Weekly 7</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22206</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Banwart&#8217;s Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Distributed Weekly 7</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 13:04:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22206</guid>
		<description>[...] Why I Dislike Classic Or Typical WCF Usage [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Why I Dislike Classic Or Typical WCF Usage [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Davy Brion</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22201</link>
		<dc:creator>Davy Brion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:49:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22201</guid>
		<description>@Alex

good to know :)

if you ever run into problems with it or have any questions, just mail me</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Alex</p>
<p>good to know <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>if you ever run into problems with it or have any questions, just mail me</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Alex Simkin</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22200</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Simkin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:33:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22200</guid>
		<description>@Davy

Pretty good. We have replaced Castle with Hiro and put our own implementation of KnowTypesProvider, but other than that, your code works just fine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Davy</p>
<p>Pretty good. We have replaced Castle with Hiro and put our own implementation of KnowTypesProvider, but other than that, your code works just fine.</p>
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		<title>By: Davy Brion</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22197</link>
		<dc:creator>Davy Brion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 14:58:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22197</guid>
		<description>@Niraj

the complexity is isolated within the infrastructural classes... the actual request handlers are as simple as they can be, so i don&#039;t see why it would be over engineering ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Niraj</p>
<p>the complexity is isolated within the infrastructural classes&#8230; the actual request handlers are as simple as they can be, so i don&#8217;t see why it would be over engineering <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Niraj</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22196</link>
		<dc:creator>Niraj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 14:44:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22196</guid>
		<description>Hi Davy,

   Your design is interesting though I have my reservations about the value addition it does versus the complexity it brings. The main driving point for me in your arguments is - coarse / fine grained operations &amp; both have their own disadvantages. I would still prefer going for coarse grained the reason being they are more explicit, easy to understand &amp; consume. I agree it would add duplication of code (considering it might be duplicated for different clients / scenarios) but this duplication is more of instantiation &amp; packing (not any algorthmic one). I would have fine grained repositories which inturn would create data &amp; expose them through coarse grained contracts. Your solution looks like over engineering.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Davy,</p>
<p>   Your design is interesting though I have my reservations about the value addition it does versus the complexity it brings. The main driving point for me in your arguments is &#8211; coarse / fine grained operations &amp; both have their own disadvantages. I would still prefer going for coarse grained the reason being they are more explicit, easy to understand &amp; consume. I agree it would add duplication of code (considering it might be duplicated for different clients / scenarios) but this duplication is more of instantiation &amp; packing (not any algorthmic one). I would have fine grained repositories which inturn would create data &amp; expose them through coarse grained contracts. Your solution looks like over engineering.</p>
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		<title>By: Davy Brion</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22195</link>
		<dc:creator>Davy Brion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 13:51:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22195</guid>
		<description>@Alex

ah, cool! how has it worked out so far?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Alex</p>
<p>ah, cool! how has it worked out so far?</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Simkin</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22194</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Simkin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 13:50:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22194</guid>
		<description>...but i don’t think anyone else actually uses it.

We started to use it from the moment I read your blogpost :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;but i don’t think anyone else actually uses it.</p>
<p>We started to use it from the moment I read your blogpost <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Marcus Rosen</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22192</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus Rosen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 09:23:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22192</guid>
		<description>By static I ment a proxy that was generated by the svcutil /WSDL tool.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By static I ment a proxy that was generated by the svcutil /WSDL tool.</p>
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		<title>By: Davy Brion</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22191</link>
		<dc:creator>Davy Brion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 08:58:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22191</guid>
		<description>i&#039;m going to assume that with &#039;static proxy&#039; you mean a class which offers methods for each operation in the service contract... otherwise i&#039;d have no idea where you got &#039;static&#039; from

dealing with channels requires some housekeeping code... if you don&#039;t want to see that repeated throughout your codebase, you put that code in a class (in this case, the proxy type) and just use instances of that class.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i&#8217;m going to assume that with &#8217;static proxy&#8217; you mean a class which offers methods for each operation in the service contract&#8230; otherwise i&#8217;d have no idea where you got &#8217;static&#8217; from</p>
<p>dealing with channels requires some housekeeping code&#8230; if you don&#8217;t want to see that repeated throughout your codebase, you put that code in a class (in this case, the proxy type) and just use instances of that class.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcus Rosen</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22190</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus Rosen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 08:44:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22190</guid>
		<description>Hi,

Is there a reason you are using a static proxy instead of the Channel Factory directly? 

Considering you control both the end-points wouldn&#039;t a Channel Factory be simpler as all you need to do is share the contracts assembly instead of re-generating the proxy everytime you add/change an operation?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi,</p>
<p>Is there a reason you are using a static proxy instead of the Channel Factory directly? </p>
<p>Considering you control both the end-points wouldn&#8217;t a Channel Factory be simpler as all you need to do is share the contracts assembly instead of re-generating the proxy everytime you add/change an operation?</p>
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		<title>By: Jack</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2009/07/why-i-dislike-classic-or-typical-wcf-usage/comment-page-1/#comment-22189</link>
		<dc:creator>Jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 05:13:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=1453#comment-22189</guid>
		<description>I also like the REST style. WCF also give a toolkit, but only a CTP version.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I also like the REST style. WCF also give a toolkit, but only a CTP version.</p>
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