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	<title>Comments on: Career Advice For Young Developers</title>
	<atom:link href="http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/</link>
	<description>Trying to walk that thin line between intelligence and ignorance</description>
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		<title>By: Bemerkenswerte Links für den Januar 2010 &#171; Johnny&#39;s Blog</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-26765</link>
		<dc:creator>Bemerkenswerte Links für den Januar 2010 &#171; Johnny&#39;s Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 Jan 2010 13:26:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-26765</guid>
		<description>[...] Career Advice For Young Developers Schon älter, aber noch immer sehr gut. Davy Brion listet einige Tipps für junge Entwickler auf, die bei der Planung der Kariere helfen können. Um eine gute Arbeit zu machen muss man diese gern machen. Wer weiss, meistens braucht man Tipps für die nächsten Schritte in seiner Laufbahn schneller als man glaubt. Einige Kommentare liefern zusätzliche Tipps, ich empfehle daher diese auch anzuschauen.     Kategorien:Medien Schlagwörter:Link       Kommentare (0) Trackbacks (0) Einen Kommentar hinterlassen Trackback [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Career Advice For Young Developers Schon älter, aber noch immer sehr gut. Davy Brion listet einige Tipps für junge Entwickler auf, die bei der Planung der Kariere helfen können. Um eine gute Arbeit zu machen muss man diese gern machen. Wer weiss, meistens braucht man Tipps für die nächsten Schritte in seiner Laufbahn schneller als man glaubt. Einige Kommentare liefern zusätzliche Tipps, ich empfehle daher diese auch anzuschauen.     Kategorien:Medien Schlagwörter:Link       Kommentare (0) Trackbacks (0) Einen Kommentar hinterlassen Trackback [...]</p>
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		<title>By: ab</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-25425</link>
		<dc:creator>ab</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jan 2010 08:55:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-25425</guid>
		<description>you forgot one crucial piece of advice which will help improve the workplace and elevate you above code monkey status: STARTING OR JOINING A UNION</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>you forgot one crucial piece of advice which will help improve the workplace and elevate you above code monkey status: STARTING OR JOINING A UNION</p>
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		<title>By: Jaco Pretorius</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-24914</link>
		<dc:creator>Jaco Pretorius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 10:07:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-24914</guid>
		<description>Excellent advice - especially the part about not focusing on Job Security.  If you start working at a big corporate you&#039;ll quickly notice that most developers are focused on outdated technologies and are usually pretty old - for exactly the reasons you&#039;ve mentioned</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent advice &#8211; especially the part about not focusing on Job Security.  If you start working at a big corporate you&#8217;ll quickly notice that most developers are focused on outdated technologies and are usually pretty old &#8211; for exactly the reasons you&#8217;ve mentioned</p>
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		<title>By: Career Advice For Young Developers, Part 2 &#124; The Inquisitive Coder &#8211; Davy Brion&#39;s Blog</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-24854</link>
		<dc:creator>Career Advice For Young Developers, Part 2 &#124; The Inquisitive Coder &#8211; Davy Brion&#39;s Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:37:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-24854</guid>
		<description>[...] over a year ago, i wrote a post which had some career advice for young software developers. That post was mostly based on things that worked for me, but obviously also on mistakes that i had [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] over a year ago, i wrote a post which had some career advice for young software developers. That post was mostly based on things that worked for me, but obviously also on mistakes that i had [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Tiago Oliveira</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-5554</link>
		<dc:creator>Tiago Oliveira</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 12:49:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-5554</guid>
		<description>I believe that the essencial point is &lt;strong&gt;&quot;Make sure you like doing your job&quot;&lt;/strong&gt; for anything that you can to do, not only developing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe that the essencial point is <strong>&#8220;Make sure you like doing your job&#8221;</strong> for anything that you can to do, not only developing.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4412</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 01:36:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4412</guid>
		<description>Informative article for us young developers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Informative article for us young developers.</p>
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		<title>By: keith</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4379</link>
		<dc:creator>keith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 04:08:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4379</guid>
		<description>Thank you for your advice!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for your advice!</p>
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		<title>By: Wilcox</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4360</link>
		<dc:creator>Wilcox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 15:49:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4360</guid>
		<description>This is terrific advice for a developer that comes from real emotional knowledge of how things work in the business world. I wish someone had said some of this stuff to me a few years ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is terrific advice for a developer that comes from real emotional knowledge of how things work in the business world. I wish someone had said some of this stuff to me a few years ago.</p>
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		<title>By: engin güller &#187; Genç Yazılımcılar İçin Kariyer Tavsiyeleri</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4351</link>
		<dc:creator>engin güller &#187; Genç Yazılımcılar İçin Kariyer Tavsiyeleri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 12:06:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4351</guid>
		<description>[...] yazı Davy Brion isimli programcının blog&#8217;undan Career Advice For Young Developers isimli yazısının [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] yazı Davy Brion isimli programcının blog&#8217;undan Career Advice For Young Developers isimli yazısının [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Elfi</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4345</link>
		<dc:creator>Elfi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 08:20:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4345</guid>
		<description>&#039;career&#039; and &#039;studies that&#039;
That&#039;s what happens when you want to leave a quick comment ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;career&#8217; and &#8217;studies that&#8217;<br />
That&#8217;s what happens when you want to leave a quick comment <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Elfi</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4344</link>
		<dc:creator>Elfi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 08:17:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4344</guid>
		<description>Nice observations ;-) However, from my seat (the nerd) it&#039;s not really that clear what the exact difference is between advice for young developers and just overall carreer and personal well-being advice per se... Moreover, some of the comments are just striking (&#039;yeeeeeeeh, you&#039;re soooo riiight&#039;). I mean, come on, good performance and well-being are guided by a strong internal motivation for what you&#039;re actually doing (Self Determination Theory, Deci &amp; Ryan; and many studies who have been supporting that in various work contexts). I don&#039;t get how you can do these activities the entire day (because that&#039;s what work is) without even thinking why you&#039;re doing it. On the other hand: it leaves nerds like us with plenty of interesting future projects ;-) 

@ Roon: many studies have been focussing on the EVLN-principle (Exit, Voice, Loyalty, Neglect) in times of downsizing, restructuring and other organizational changes. The bottom line is: in case of high employability(*), employees tend to seek other jobs when confronted with job insecure times. High employable workers_will_find (as Davy would say) other jobs. The most strategic way in these changing times (and beware, it will only get worse) is investment in your own employability rate. And the only way to manage thàt in an effective way is... by liking your job and being internally motivated. Look at this, one beautiful round circle! ;-)

(*) simple: you have a good profile which allows you to do a broad range of jobs</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice observations <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' />  However, from my seat (the nerd) it&#8217;s not really that clear what the exact difference is between advice for young developers and just overall carreer and personal well-being advice per se&#8230; Moreover, some of the comments are just striking (&#8216;yeeeeeeeh, you&#8217;re soooo riiight&#8217;). I mean, come on, good performance and well-being are guided by a strong internal motivation for what you&#8217;re actually doing (Self Determination Theory, Deci &amp; Ryan; and many studies who have been supporting that in various work contexts). I don&#8217;t get how you can do these activities the entire day (because that&#8217;s what work is) without even thinking why you&#8217;re doing it. On the other hand: it leaves nerds like us with plenty of interesting future projects <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>@ Roon: many studies have been focussing on the EVLN-principle (Exit, Voice, Loyalty, Neglect) in times of downsizing, restructuring and other organizational changes. The bottom line is: in case of high employability(*), employees tend to seek other jobs when confronted with job insecure times. High employable workers_will_find (as Davy would say) other jobs. The most strategic way in these changing times (and beware, it will only get worse) is investment in your own employability rate. And the only way to manage thàt in an effective way is&#8230; by liking your job and being internally motivated. Look at this, one beautiful round circle! <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>(*) simple: you have a good profile which allows you to do a broad range of jobs</p>
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		<title>By: Lieven op De Beeck</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4343</link>
		<dc:creator>Lieven op De Beeck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 07:50:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4343</guid>
		<description>Hey Davy, Just found your post through the top delicious list!
Congrats and keep up the good work!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Davy, Just found your post through the top delicious list!<br />
Congrats and keep up the good work!</p>
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		<title>By: Davy Brion</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4340</link>
		<dc:creator>Davy Brion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 06:24:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4340</guid>
		<description>lots of great comments here... thx :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>lots of great comments here&#8230; thx <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Arun</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4338</link>
		<dc:creator>Arun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 05:19:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4338</guid>
		<description>In the context of first 2 points I would like to &lt;a href=&quot;http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2005/june15/jobs-061505.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;quote&lt;/a&gt; Steve Jobs:
&lt;blockquote&gt;When I was 17, I read a quote that went something like: &quot;If you live each day as if it was your last, someday you&#039;ll most certainly be right.&quot; It made an impression on me, and since then, for the past 33 years, I have looked in the mirror every morning and asked myself: &quot;If today were the last day of my life, would I want to do what I am about to do today?&quot; And whenever the answer has been &quot;No&quot; for too many days in a row, I know I need to change something.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

On learning from co-workers, you learn the best if you&#039;re at a place where you respect everybody. Something about everyother guy you work with fascinates you. Be it the speed at which they take decisions, the depth they go analysing most difficult problems or the smart code they write.

As others said, a lot of passion into work originates from environment. Especially from freedom, challenges you face and feel of ownership for your components.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the context of first 2 points I would like to <a href="http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2005/june15/jobs-061505.html" rel="nofollow">quote</a> Steve Jobs:</p>
<blockquote><p>When I was 17, I read a quote that went something like: &#8220;If you live each day as if it was your last, someday you&#8217;ll most certainly be right.&#8221; It made an impression on me, and since then, for the past 33 years, I have looked in the mirror every morning and asked myself: &#8220;If today were the last day of my life, would I want to do what I am about to do today?&#8221; And whenever the answer has been &#8220;No&#8221; for too many days in a row, I know I need to change something.</p></blockquote>
<p>On learning from co-workers, you learn the best if you&#8217;re at a place where you respect everybody. Something about everyother guy you work with fascinates you. Be it the speed at which they take decisions, the depth they go analysing most difficult problems or the smart code they write.</p>
<p>As others said, a lot of passion into work originates from environment. Especially from freedom, challenges you face and feel of ownership for your components.</p>
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		<title>By: Log0</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4337</link>
		<dc:creator>Log0</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 05:18:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4337</guid>
		<description>An assertion to many similar posts, but it is worth repeating.

If we cling on immediate rewards ( say, money? ), we are going to miss something big out there. Yea, it is really cool to work with smart people! Sometimes, don&#039;t you feel want to skip those people who are muddling through life?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An assertion to many similar posts, but it is worth repeating.</p>
<p>If we cling on immediate rewards ( say, money? ), we are going to miss something big out there. Yea, it is really cool to work with smart people! Sometimes, don&#8217;t you feel want to skip those people who are muddling through life?</p>
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		<title>By: Effectize</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4336</link>
		<dc:creator>Effectize</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 04:59:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4336</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;89 Ways for You to Become the Coolest Programmer in the World...&lt;/strong&gt;

Since there are dozens of posts on becoming a better developer, but no single post with all the advice you need, perhaps, you&#039;ll find this short guide useful.
1. Learn the Skills You Need

Learn the programming basics

&quot;The goal of this guide is to b...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>89 Ways for You to Become the Coolest Programmer in the World&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>Since there are dozens of posts on becoming a better developer, but no single post with all the advice you need, perhaps, you&#8217;ll find this short guide useful.<br />
1. Learn the Skills You Need</p>
<p>Learn the programming basics</p>
<p>&#8220;The goal of this guide is to b&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: si</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4333</link>
		<dc:creator>si</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 04:23:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4333</guid>
		<description>A young developer needs to get experience, and lots of jobs require 1-3 years experience, so personally I&#039;m not sure about the first 3 items, since getting a foot in the door can be the hardest part. I started as a junior programmer (coding, network &amp; tech support, cabling, whatever was asked of me) and worked my way up, but of course that depends on where you are in the world and your qualifications. I&#039;m now not far off what most developers are paid at Microsoft.

Also, I see &quot;code monkey&quot; in the same light as &quot;lab rat&quot;, both terms can be used in a derogatory way, but I don&#039;t mind the label (and neither do some lab rats I know), binary simian also comes to mind :)

So I like your list, but IMHO the first 3 items may only apply to developers with a few years experience.

Finally, I used to think what BB says is true, but ~8 years ago, after working 10 years in the industry (lasting on average 2 years per job before getting bored and restless), I finally found a good job with interesting work with good people that pays well. FWIW, I work in healthcare developing clinical applications, which is probably a reasonable industry to be in in this economic environment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A young developer needs to get experience, and lots of jobs require 1-3 years experience, so personally I&#8217;m not sure about the first 3 items, since getting a foot in the door can be the hardest part. I started as a junior programmer (coding, network &amp; tech support, cabling, whatever was asked of me) and worked my way up, but of course that depends on where you are in the world and your qualifications. I&#8217;m now not far off what most developers are paid at Microsoft.</p>
<p>Also, I see &#8220;code monkey&#8221; in the same light as &#8220;lab rat&#8221;, both terms can be used in a derogatory way, but I don&#8217;t mind the label (and neither do some lab rats I know), binary simian also comes to mind <img src='http://davybrion.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>So I like your list, but IMHO the first 3 items may only apply to developers with a few years experience.</p>
<p>Finally, I used to think what BB says is true, but ~8 years ago, after working 10 years in the industry (lasting on average 2 years per job before getting bored and restless), I finally found a good job with interesting work with good people that pays well. FWIW, I work in healthcare developing clinical applications, which is probably a reasonable industry to be in in this economic environment.</p>
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		<title>By: Nathan</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4324</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2008 23:54:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4324</guid>
		<description>Nice post. I enjoy it when people emphasize job satisfaction over career advancement, because career advancement is an empty prize and besides, job satisfaction leads to career advancement by is very nature while a lack of job satisfaction can make career advancement very difficult to achieve. I have great sympathy for those of you who have commented that it is not worthwhile or a vain daydream to find satisfaction in your career as software developers, or that you are a software developer because the paycheck is higher that some other alternative career. If you cannot take enjoyment out of the time you spend at work, I wonder how rich is the satisfaction you take out of your personal life? Accepting such a fate is a tragedy and betrays a gross malignment between ones conscious mind and the universe, and accepting it so completely as to recommend it as advice to young developers is beyond horrifying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice post. I enjoy it when people emphasize job satisfaction over career advancement, because career advancement is an empty prize and besides, job satisfaction leads to career advancement by is very nature while a lack of job satisfaction can make career advancement very difficult to achieve. I have great sympathy for those of you who have commented that it is not worthwhile or a vain daydream to find satisfaction in your career as software developers, or that you are a software developer because the paycheck is higher that some other alternative career. If you cannot take enjoyment out of the time you spend at work, I wonder how rich is the satisfaction you take out of your personal life? Accepting such a fate is a tragedy and betrays a gross malignment between ones conscious mind and the universe, and accepting it so completely as to recommend it as advice to young developers is beyond horrifying.</p>
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		<title>By: Trevor</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4318</link>
		<dc:creator>Trevor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2008 18:27:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4318</guid>
		<description>I had to make this very choice, last week.

A job with A LOT more money (living close to my girlfriend), or the current job I have (as an intern), which is very very fun for me, but across the country.

I chose the lower-paying, far away job because this is exactly what I want to do, and this is the perfect opportunity for me to get very good at it, by working with true experts in the field (optimization algorithms).

I graduate from undergrad with a BS in computer science this coming May, but I have already signed on. It should be a relaxing senior year for me now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had to make this very choice, last week.</p>
<p>A job with A LOT more money (living close to my girlfriend), or the current job I have (as an intern), which is very very fun for me, but across the country.</p>
<p>I chose the lower-paying, far away job because this is exactly what I want to do, and this is the perfect opportunity for me to get very good at it, by working with true experts in the field (optimization algorithms).</p>
<p>I graduate from undergrad with a BS in computer science this coming May, but I have already signed on. It should be a relaxing senior year for me now.</p>
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		<title>By: Davy Brion</title>
		<link>http://davybrion.com/blog/2008/10/career-advice-for-young-developers/comment-page-1/#comment-4316</link>
		<dc:creator>Davy Brion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2008 18:02:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://davybrion.com/blog/?p=521#comment-4316</guid>
		<description>@Roon

With the current economical climate, i don&#039;t know what &#039;kind&#039; of company would be better to join at this point... it seems like most company are vulnerable right now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Roon</p>
<p>With the current economical climate, i don&#8217;t know what &#8216;kind&#8217; of company would be better to join at this point&#8230; it seems like most company are vulnerable right now.</p>
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